[minutes] BPWG Teleconference 13 October 2009

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[minutes] BPWG Teleconference 13 October 2009

Francois Daoust
Hi,

The minutes of today's call are available at:
  http://www.w3.org/2009/10/13-bpwg-minutes.html
  (temporary "access denied" problem, should be fixed soon)

... and copied as raw text below.

Discussed, resolved or actioned:
- BP 1.5 (the Addendum) will henceforth be known as "Extended Guidelines
for Mobile Web Best Practices".

- daoust to prepare the registration form and to make the F2F official.

- Jo to make changes to CT Landscape and then propose to group

- We are waiting for initial input for the CT guidelines test suite.
Please step forward if you have tests of if you would be available to
work on the test suite.

Thanks,
Francois.


-----
Mobile Web Best Practices Working Group Teleconference

13 Oct 2009

    [2]Agenda

       [2] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Oct/0014.html

    See also: [3]IRC log

       [3] http://www.w3.org/2009/10/13-bpwg-irc

Attendees

    Present
           jo, francois, DKA, miguel, tomhume, brucel, yeliz,
           Phil_Archer, EdC, jsmanrique

    Regrets
           kai, miguel, SeanP, jeffs, adam

    Chair
           jo

    Scribe
           Tom, Dan

Contents

      * [4]Topics
          1. [5]Admin
          2. [6]Update on MWABP (BP 2)
          3. [7]BP 1.5
          4. [8]Update on CT
          5. [9]Issues and actions
      * [10]Summary of Action Items
      _________________________________________________________

Admin

    <francois> [11]Draft agenda for F2F

      [11] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Member/member-bpwg/2009Oct/0008.html

    jo: Sent out an outline agenda, suggest we spend a day on MWABP,
    another day on CT, and a half day tidying things up
    ... everyone happy with that?

    francois: Offers to set up a registration form

    <francois> ACTION: daoust to prepare the registration form and to
    officialize the F2F [recorded in
    [12]http://www.w3.org/2009/10/13-bpwg-minutes.html#action01]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-1020 - Prepare the registration form and
    to officialize the F2F [on François Daoust - due 2009-10-20].

Update on MWABP (BP 2)

    jo: there was supposed to be an editorial session last Friday, now
    pushed back to this Friday
    ... if you want to join this, say so and we'll arrange a conf bridge

    phila: meeting from 12

    jo: so we'll probably start around 1
    ... I've not seen any comments on the list.

    francois: there is one from Arthur Barstow on MWABP

    <francois> [13]Comment from Art

      [13]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg-comments/2009OctDec/0029.html

    francois: I've already replied to him. His second part is a good
    point, the appendices are suffixed with the non-normative but
    there's nothing normative in these docs because they're BPs

    jo: The problem is, that's the way the xmlspec works. This might be
    easier to fix as it's HTML. This looks editorial and easy to fix.

BP 1.5

    <francois> ISSUE-300?

    <trackbot> ISSUE-300 -- Addendum to BP reads as though it is a
    normative extension - PH requests we find a new name for it -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [14]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/issues/300

      [14] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/issues/300

    <DKA> Can we call it "BP Evolution"?

    jo: We've a couple of comments from Phil and Kai.

    <francois> [15]Suggestions for titles for BP1.5

      [15] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Oct/0009.html

    phil: I'm happy to go with what Kai said

    <PhilA2> No no, BP Intelligent Design please, DKA

    jo: I don't feel strongly about this. Anyone have any comments?

    <PhilA2> Title: "Extended Guideline for Mobile Web Best Practices"

    <PhilA2> Subtitle: "a non-normative companion document for Mobile
    Web Best

    francois: the MWBP are not normative. I don't think the subtitle is
    needed. Looking at the document from an external POV the extract is
    already clear, it's just about the title.
    ... I prefer your suggestion Jo.

    jo: let's decide between the two. Straw poll...

    <jo> 1. 1 Extended Evaluations for Mobile Web Best Practices

    <jo> 2. Extended Guidelines for Mobile Web Best Practices

    2

    <DKA> 2 - but I'd prefer "extended dance re-mix of mobile web best
    practices"

    <EdC> 2

    <yeliz> 2

    <francois> 2

    <jsmanrique> 2

    <jo> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: BP 1.5 (the Addendum) will henceforth be
    known as Extended Guidelines for Mobile Web Best Practices

    <francois> +1

    +1

    <jsmanrique> +1

    <EdC> +1

    <PhilA2> +1

    <yeliz> +1

    RESOLUTION: BP 1.5 (the Addendum) will henceforth be known as
    Extended Guidelines for Mobile Web Best Practices

Update on CT

    jo: Not had too much traffic on this, on-list.

    francois: we had confirmation from Michael Macqueen that he's
    satisfied with the change in the title.

    <EdC> Has the release of the documents (CTG, MWABP) and the call for
    comments been advertised? Where?

    jo: That's it then. Have we sent out a notification to the groups we
    want to comment on this?

    <EdC> What about outside W3C?

    francois: I sent an email to the chairs of the groups for the lists,
    and to the HTTPBis WG

    jo: People who commented in the past will be aware, but it's a good
    question. Who'd we originally invite to comment outside the W3C?

    <EdC> For instance: what about OMA ???

    francois: the WMLProgramming list, but that's all.
    ... if we (as a group) put the word out... we're asking for people
    to review the documents, we're not trying to hide them
    ... one of the chairs of the OMA is the HCG here in W3C, and one of
    the participants in the group is the official liaison with the OMA
    and has asked that this document be presented to the OMA.

    edC: are there other relevant institutions or consortiums that the
    W3C is in consortium with?

    francois: I can't think of any others.

    <francois> [16]W3C Liaison list

      [16] http://www.w3.org/2001/11/StdLiaison

    <EdC> ok.

    jo: Eduardo, unless you have anything specific further to add on
    this, I suggest we move on...
    ... The sadly neglected CT landscape document is the next topic up.

    <jo> [17]ACTION-1015

      [17] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1015

    jo: We have two choices: drop it or publish it. Right now it's
    half-published.

    <francois> [for the record, I contacted chairs of TAG, HTML WG,
    XHTML2 WG, WebApps WG, HCG (for OMA), Web Security Context working
    group plus HTTPBis]

    jo: I suggest we request publication as is.

    <EdC> As is with a remark or some statement about the status of the
    document?

    <jo> PROPOSED RESOLUTION: Ref the CT Landscape document, modulo
    minor editorial changes request publication as a Note.

    jo: I don't think anyone's ever going to read it... francois?

    francois: I think that's a good idea.

    dka: wasn't this document intended as a thought activity for the
    guidelines? Do we really need to publish it?

    jo: it's published as a working draft right now.

    <jo> [18]http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/WD-ct-landscape-20071025/

      [18] http://www.w3.org/TR/2007/WD-ct-landscape-20071025/

    dka: I don't think its worth making another announcement etc

    jo: unless we can delete this from TR-space, we have an incomplete
    document. We should complete or delete.

    <EdC> Out of tracability concerns, I would be wary of deleting the
    document.

    jo: it's not without precedent to have a document like this hanging
    around

    <PhilA2> [19]http://www.w3.org/2007/powder/

      [19] http://www.w3.org/2007/powder/

    PhilA: In POWDER we started to document and didn't finish them, they
    remained working drafts and will never be anything else. On the old
    WG homepage, you can see beneath publications and tools a section of
    obsolete documents..
    ... they don't even have note status, we just say publicly "we
    stopped"
    ... Whilst it's preferable I don't think you have to turn everything
    into a working note.

    jo: I would be averse to deleting it
    ... I propose to make some light editorial changes to the
    introduction and point out it's been largely superceded. Let's take
    a resolution on this next week.
    ... objections?

    <EdC> OK with me.

    <jo> ACTION: Jo to make changes to CT Landscape and then propose to
    group [recorded in
    [20]http://www.w3.org/2009/10/13-bpwg-minutes.html#action02]

    <trackbot> Created ACTION-1021 - Make changes to CT Landscape and
    then propose to group [on Jo Rabin - due 2009-10-20].

    jo: we also have the test suite to discuss, for transformation.

    francois: we're waiting for initial input on the test suite, if we
    don't have any input then we have to get started ASAP.

    jo: bruce, did I note you'd said you didn't have anything for Opera
    to offer?

    bruce: yes

    <jo> [21]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/issues/open

      [21] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/issues/open

Issues and actions

    <francois> ACTION-796?

    <trackbot> ACTION-796 -- Daniel Appelquist to contact BBC to see if
    they can make their mobile web site mobileOK -- due 2008-06-25 --
    OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [22]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/796

      [22] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/796

    <francois> close ACTION-796

    <trackbot> ACTION-796 Contact BBC to see if they can make their
    mobile web site mobileOK closed

    <francois> ACTION-870?

    <trackbot> ACTION-870 -- Daniel Appelquist to liaise with Seungyun
    and Jonathan re setting up a call in 4 weeks with a view to having 2
    weekly calls in the morning European time -- due 2008-10-28 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [23]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/870

      [23] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/870

    <francois> close ACTION-870

    <trackbot> ACTION-870 Liaise with Seungyun and Jonathan re setting
    up a call in 4 weeks with a view to having 2 weekly calls in the
    morning European time closed

    <DKA> Scribe: Dan

    <DKA> ScribeNick: DKA

    <francois> ACTION-935?

    <trackbot> ACTION-935 -- Daniel Appelquist to lead discussion on
    list on Korean mobileOK proposals -- due 2009-04-03 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [24]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/935

      [24] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/935

    <francois> close ACTION-935

    <trackbot> ACTION-935 Lead discussion on list on Korean mobileOK
    proposals closed

    <EdC> What about 885?

    <francois> ACTION-956?

    <trackbot> ACTION-956 -- François Daoust to review last call
    comments on CT to see where the responses need editing -- due
    2009-04-14 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [25]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/956

      [25] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/956

    <francois> close ACTION-956

    <trackbot> ACTION-956 Review last call comments on CT to see where
    the responses need editing closed

    <francois> ACTION-964?

    <trackbot> ACTION-964 -- Tom Hume to review AtomDB for potential
    inclusion/reference in MWABP -- due 2009-06-09 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [26]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/964

      [26] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/964

    <francois> [27]background on AtomDB

      [27] http://www.w3.org/2009/06/02-bpwg-minutes.html#item01

    <tomhume_>
    [28]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg-comments/2009Apr
    Jun/0003.html

      [28]
http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg-comments/2009AprJun/0003.html

    <francois> ACTION-987?

    <trackbot> ACTION-987 -- Daniel Appelquist to draft a blog post on
    mobileOK Scheme -- due 2009-07-07 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [29]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/987

      [29] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/987

    <francois> ACTION-998?

    <trackbot> ACTION-998 -- Adam Connors to extract some useful info
    from the discussion around ACTION-790 and add it to the doc -- due
    2009-07-21 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [30]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/998

      [30] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/998

    <francois> close ACTION-998

    <trackbot> ACTION-998 Extract some useful info from the discussion
    around ACTION-790 and add it to the doc closed

    <francois> ACTION-1003?

    <trackbot> ACTION-1003 -- Bruce Lawson to follow up within Opera as
    to what exactly the XSS test scripts supplied by chaals guard
    against -- due 2009-09-08 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [31]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1003

      [31] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1003

    <francois> ACTION-1005?

    <trackbot> ACTION-1005 -- François Daoust to set up a survey to find
    dates for F2F, either week of Nov 16, Nov 30 or Dec 7, and ask for
    hosting offers in Europe -- due 2009-09-22 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [32]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1005

      [32] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1005

    <francois> close ACTION-1005

    <trackbot> ACTION-1005 Set up a survey to find dates for F2F, either
    week of Nov 16, Nov 30 or Dec 7, and ask for hosting offers in
    Europe closed

    <francois> ACTION-1007?

    <trackbot> ACTION-1007 -- Sean Patterson to check if novarra has
    tests they could contribute for CT guidelines -- due 2009-09-22 --
    OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [33]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1007

      [33] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1007

    <francois> ACTION-1008?

    <trackbot> ACTION-1008 -- Adam Connors to check if Google has tests
    they could contribute for CT guidelines -- due 2009-09-22 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [34]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1008

      [34] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1008

    <francois> ACTION-1009?

    <trackbot> ACTION-1009 -- Bruce Lawson to check if Opera has tests
    they could contribute for CT guidelines -- due 2009-09-22 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [35]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1009

      [35] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1009

    <francois> [Nothing to contribute from Opera's side]

    <francois> Close ACTION-1009

    <trackbot> ACTION-1009 Check if Opera has tests they could
    contribute for CT guidelines closed

    <francois> ACTION-1010?

    <trackbot> ACTION-1010 -- Adam Connors to organise editor's meeting
    -- due 2009-09-29 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [36]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1010

      [36] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1010

    <francois> close ACTION-1010

    <trackbot> ACTION-1010 Organise editor's meeting closed

    <francois> close ACTION-1011

    <trackbot> ACTION-1011 Amend 4.1.5.3 etc cf EdC's Comments
    [37]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Sep/0062.htm
    l closed

      [37] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Sep/0062.html

    <francois> close ACTION-1012

    <trackbot> ACTION-1012 Move text per eduardo's comment ACTION-989
    [38]http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Jun/0143.htm
    l closed

      [38] http://lists.w3.org/Archives/Public/public-bpwg/2009Jun/0143.html

    <francois> close ACTION-1013

    <trackbot> ACTION-1013 Add a note that the X-Headers have been
    provisionally registered closed

    <francois> close ACTION-1014

    <trackbot> ACTION-1014 Insert above definition of same origin in the
    document closed

    <francois> close ACTION-1015

    <trackbot> ACTION-1015 Recommend to group what to do with landscape
    doc closed

    <francois> close ACTION-1016

    <trackbot> ACTION-1016 Get back to group on hosting F2F by tomorrow
    closed

    <francois> ACTION-1017?

    <trackbot> ACTION-1017 -- François Daoust to get MWABP published as
    Last Call and ensure Chairs announcement is properly sent -- due
    2009-10-06 -- OPEN

    <trackbot>
    [39]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1017

      [39] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1017

    <francois> close ACTION-1017

    <trackbot> ACTION-1017 Get MWABP published as Last Call and ensure
    Chairs announcement is properly sent closed

    <francois> close ACTION-1018

    <trackbot> ACTION-1018 Call editorial meeting on Friday 9th Oct to
    discuss MWABP closed

    <francois> close ACTION-1019

    <trackbot> ACTION-1019 Get CT published as Last Call and ensure
    chairs announcement closed

    <EdC> 1020 and 1021 are new ones.

    <francois> close ACTION-1004

    <trackbot> ACTION-1004 Cancel TPAC F2F for BPWG closed

    <francois> ACTION-1001?

    <trackbot> ACTION-1001 -- François Daoust to review tests provided
    by Charles on same origin policy -- due 2009-08-18 -- PENDINGREVIEW

    <trackbot>
    [40]http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1001

      [40] http://www.w3.org/2005/MWI/BPWG/Group/track/actions/1001

    <francois> close ACTION-1001

    <trackbot> ACTION-1001 Review tests provided by Charles on same
    origin policy closed

    <brucel> bye all

    <jsmanrique> bye

    Jo: Thanks all!

    :)

Summary of Action Items

    [NEW] ACTION: daoust to prepare the registration form and to
    officialize the F2F [recorded in
    [41]http://www.w3.org/2009/10/13-bpwg-minutes.html#action01]
    [NEW] ACTION: Jo to make changes to CT Landscape and then propose to
    group [recorded in
    [42]http://www.w3.org/2009/10/13-bpwg-minutes.html#action02]

    [End of minutes]


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Re: [minutes] BPWG Teleconference 13 October 2009

gina-11
Hello Francois,

Thank you for the opportunity to review the minutes of the Conference  
held on October 13, 2009. I suppose the link is available now. I was  
able to open it.

I would like to specify one moment from this dialog:
"jo: there was supposed to be an editorial session last Friday, now  
pushed back to this Friday
... if you want to join this, say so and we'll arrange a conf bridge

phila: meeting from 12"

What do you mean under "pushed back to this friday"? Are you going to  
have a meeting this week?


Best Regards,

Gina Travis             Alierra Design Company
[hidden email]        http://www.alierra.com